-
if you have not read ken o'keefe's account
of the assault on the mavi marmara,
here it is,
in his own words :
"I said this straight to Israeli agents, probably of Mossad or Shin Bet, and I say it again now, on the morning of the attack I was directly involved in the disarming of two Israeli Commandos. This was a forcible, non-negotiable, separation of weapons from commandos who had already murdered two brothers that I had seen that day. One brother with a bullet entering dead center in his forehead, in what appeared to be an execution. I knew the commandos were murdering when I removed a 9mm pistol from one of them. I had that gun in my hands and as an ex-US Marine with training in the use of guns it was completely within my power to use that gun on the commando who may have been the murderer of one of my brothers. But that is not what I, nor any other defender of the ship did. I took that weapon away, removed the bullets, proper lead bullets, separated them from the weapon and hid the gun. I did this in the hopes that we would repel the attack and submit this weapon as evidence in a criminal trial against Israeli authorities for mass murder.
I also helped to physically separate one commando from his assault rifle, which another brother apparently threw into the sea. I and hundreds of others know the truth that makes a mockery of the brave and moral Israeli military. We had in our full possession, three completely disarmed and helpless commandos. These boys were at our mercy, they were out of reach of their fellow murderers, inside the ship and surrounded by 100 or more men. I looked into the eyes of all three of these boys and I can tell you they had the fear of God in them. They looked at us as if we were them, and I have no doubt they did not believe there was any way they would survive that day. They looked like frightened children in the face of an abusive father.
But they did not face an enemy as ruthless as they. Instead the woman provided basic first aid, and ultimately they were released, battered and bruised for sure, but alive. Able to live another day. Able to feel the sun over head and the embrace of loved ones. Unlike those they murdered. Despite mourning the loss of our brothers, feeling rage towards these boys, we let them go. The Israeli prostitutes of propaganda can spew all of their disgusting bile all they wish, the commandos are the murders, we are the defenders, and yet we fought. We fought not just for our lives, not just for our cargo, not just for the people of Palestine, we fought in the name of justice and humanity. We were right to do so, in every way."
-
here you have spoken many truths
you have the words and perception
of a warrior but you fight with words
and we all know about the pen and sword
-
lot's of things
started in egypt
Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.
Surely some revelation is at hand;
Surely the Second Coming is at hand.
The Second Coming! Hardly are those words out
When a vast image out of Spritus Mundi
Troubles my sight: somewhere in the sands of the desert.
A shape with lion body and the head of a man,
A gaze blank and pitiless as the sun,
Is moving its slow thighs, while all about it
Reel shadows of the indignant desert birds.
The darkness drops again; but now I know
That twenty centuries of stony sleep
were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle,
And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?
"he who
says that he finds no pleasure in sounds and melodies and
music is either a liar and a hypocrite or he is not in his right
senses, and is outside of the category of men and beasts. Those
who prohibit music do so in order that they may keep the
Divine commandment, but theologians are agreed that it is
permissible to hear musical instruments if they are not used for
diversion, and if the mind is not led to wickedness through
hearing them. Many traditions are cited in support of this
view. Thus, it is related that A isha said : " A slave-girl was
singing in my house when Umar asked leave to enter. As
soon as she heard his step she ran away. He came in and the
Apostle smiled. O Apostle of God, cried Umar, what hath
made thee smile ? The Apostle answered, A slave-girl was
singing here, but she ran away as soon as she heard thy step.
I will not depart, said Umar, until I hear what the Apostle
heard. So the Apostle called the girl back and she began to
sing, the Apostle listening to her." Many of the Companions
have related similar traditions, which Abu ( Abd al- Rahman
al-Sulami has collected in his Kitdb al-Samd 2 ; and he has
pronounced such audition to be permissible. In practising
audition, however, the Sufi Shaykhs desire, not permissibility as
the vulgar do, but spiritual advantages. Licence is proper for
beasts, but men who are subject to the obligations of religion
ought to seek spiritual benefit from their actions. Once, when
I was at Merv, one of the leaders of the Ahl-i hadith* and the
most celebrated of them all said to me : "I have composed
a work on the permissibility of audition." I replied : " It is
a great calamity to religion that the Imam should have made
lawful an amusement which is the root of all immorality." " If
you do not hold it to be lawful," said he, " why do you practise
it ? " I answered : " Its lawfulness depends on circumstances
and cannot be asserted absolutely : if audition produces a lawful
effect on the mind, then it is lawful ; it is unlawful if the effect
is unlawful, and permissible if the effect is permissible."
Chapter on the Principles of Audition.
You must know that the principles of audition vary with the
variety of temperaments, just as there are different desires in
various hearts, and it is tyranny to lay down one law for all.
Auditors (mustami anjmay be divided into two classes: (i) those
who hear the spiritual meaning, (2) those who hear the material
sound. There are good and evil results in each case. Listening
to sweet sounds produces an effervescence (jrhalaydri) of the
substance moulded in Man : true (Jwqq) if the substance be
true, false (bdtil) if the substance be false. When the stuff of
a man s temperament is evil, that which he hears will be evil
too. The whole of this topic is illustrated by the story of
David, whom God made His vicegerent and gave him a sweet
voice and caused his throat to be a melodious pipe, so that
wild beasts and birds came from mountain and plain to hear
him, and the water ceased to flow and the birds fell from the
air. It is related that during a month s space the people who
were gathered round him in the desert ate no food, and the
children neither wept nor asked for milk ; and whenever the
folk departed it was found that many had died of the rapture
that seized them as they listened to his voice : one time, it is
said, the tale of the dead amounted to seven hundred maidens
and twelve thousand old men. Then God, wishing to separate
those who listened to the voice and followed their temperament
from the followers of the truth (ahl-i haqq) who listened to the
spiritual reality, permitted Iblis to work his will and display
his wiles. Iblis fashioned a mandoline and a flute and took
up a station opposite to the place where David was singing.
AUDITION. 403
David s audience became divided into two parties : the blest and
the damned. Those who were destined to damnation lent ear
to the music of Iblis, while those who were destined to felicity
remained listening to the voice of David. The spiritualists
(ahl-i mctnf) were conscious of nothing except David s voice,
for they saw God alone ; if they heard the Devil s music, they
regarded it as a temptation proceeding from God, and if they
heard David s voice, they recognized it as being a direction from
God ; wherefore they abandoned all things that are merely
subsidiary and saw both right and wrong as they really are.
When a man has audition of this kind, whatever he hears is
lawful to him. Some impostors, however, say that their audition
is contrary to the reality. This is absurd, for the perfection of
saintship consists in seeing everything as it really is, that the
vision may be right ; if you see otherwise, the vision is wrong.
The Apostle said : " O God, let us see things as they are."
Similarly, right audition consists in hearing everything as it is
in quality and predicament. The reason why men are seduced
and their passions excited by musical instruments is that they
hear unreally : if their audition corresponded with the reality,
they would escape from all evil consequences. The people of
error heard the word of God, and their error waxed greater
than before. Some of them quoted " The eyes attain not unto
Him" (Kor. vi, 103) as a demonstration that there shall be no
vision of God ; some cited " Then He settled Himself on the
throne" (Kor. vii, 52) to prove that position and direction may
be affirmed of Him ; and some argued that God actually
"comes", since He has said, "And thy Lord shall come and
the angels rank by rank" (Kor. Ixxxix, 23). Inasmuch as error
was implanted in their minds, it profited them nothing to hear
the Word of God. The Unitarian, on the other hand, when
he peruses a poem, regards the Creator of the poet s nature
and the Disposer of his thoughts, and drawing an admonition
therefrom, sees in the act an evidence of the Agent. Thus he
finds the right way even in falsehood, while those whom we have
mentioned above lose the way in the midst of truth."
yes juan
a vast improvement
much easier to read
one request though:
please do not change the format
so that it is so wide that we have
to shuttle back and forth to read it
paul at 'war in context' and phillip
at 'mondoweiss' have done this
and it is very frustrating trying to
read them in said fashion
thank you for your efforts
very much appreciated
est
© 2025 All Rights Reserved
-
yes, up here, in vermont
we have some discussion going on
about wind turbines,
and hydro-electric
[small scale, canada [ian interests] bought all
the big dams/gas co./elect. co. etc...]
about vt yankee [entergy]
down at the corner of vt/nh/mass
i see a lot of small/medium scale solar,locally
and also a natural gas pipeline ? [under the lake]
as always a balance ? between local and corporate
i would much rather see where my power comes from
-
-
ok bill
if the stat i heard, is correct
for every 'target' 'attained'
there are 49 innocents killed
it's lazy and cowardly
and it is not 'war'
although it is a 'war crime'
-
-
professor,
when you say
assassination,
i hear murder
as for the rest
you don't mince words
thank you, for that
-
-
well, look at that
an educated man with a little sway
speaks for everyone, bothered by this
forget about apartheid
they are, as we speak, courting
their own destruction
-
-
this is murder,
plain and simple
what is
happening to us ?
are we are becoming
the 'enemy',
through ignorance
and fear ?
-
-
we need to call it what it is
it is murder - it is not war
another example of technology
getting ahead of morality
why the hell are we so good
at killing people and causing misery
and so lousy at sorting things out,
without resorting to this brutality
the memo i got, said > 'thou shall not kill'
did you all get a different one ?
-
-
reincarnation, sure
but it'll take a
billion ages or more
don't count on it.
better to grasp
this life, fully.
when you consider
all that it took,
to get here
-
-
i never went anywhere
people think they
come and go
it's understandable
but when you discover
what you really are
you will understand
we've never been apart
-
-
wow
you'd think israel was the center of the universe
i can assure you it is not and never will be
that certain people called 'dibs' on this place and
changed the name and occupied the original inhabitants
and continues to do injury to them and all of us
while we sit back and wait for what ? to happen
there needs to be a reverse emancipation
every single palestinian should leave that place
the whole world will receive you with open arms
and then we will see what those 'settlers' got [get]
-
-
if you have not read ken o'keefe's account
of the assault on the mavi marmara,
here it is,
in his own words :
"I said this straight to Israeli agents, probably of Mossad or Shin Bet, and I say it again now, on the morning of the attack I was directly involved in the disarming of two Israeli Commandos. This was a forcible, non-negotiable, separation of weapons from commandos who had already murdered two brothers that I had seen that day. One brother with a bullet entering dead center in his forehead, in what appeared to be an execution. I knew the commandos were murdering when I removed a 9mm pistol from one of them. I had that gun in my hands and as an ex-US Marine with training in the use of guns it was completely within my power to use that gun on the commando who may have been the murderer of one of my brothers. But that is not what I, nor any other defender of the ship did. I took that weapon away, removed the bullets, proper lead bullets, separated them from the weapon and hid the gun. I did this in the hopes that we would repel the attack and submit this weapon as evidence in a criminal trial against Israeli authorities for mass murder.
I also helped to physically separate one commando from his assault rifle, which another brother apparently threw into the sea. I and hundreds of others know the truth that makes a mockery of the brave and moral Israeli military. We had in our full possession, three completely disarmed and helpless commandos. These boys were at our mercy, they were out of reach of their fellow murderers, inside the ship and surrounded by 100 or more men. I looked into the eyes of all three of these boys and I can tell you they had the fear of God in them. They looked at us as if we were them, and I have no doubt they did not believe there was any way they would survive that day. They looked like frightened children in the face of an abusive father.
But they did not face an enemy as ruthless as they. Instead the woman provided basic first aid, and ultimately they were released, battered and bruised for sure, but alive. Able to live another day. Able to feel the sun over head and the embrace of loved ones. Unlike those they murdered. Despite mourning the loss of our brothers, feeling rage towards these boys, we let them go. The Israeli prostitutes of propaganda can spew all of their disgusting bile all they wish, the commandos are the murders, we are the defenders, and yet we fought. We fought not just for our lives, not just for our cargo, not just for the people of Palestine, we fought in the name of justice and humanity. We were right to do so, in every way."
-
-
thanks bill
i enjoyed that
you're the first one [on the net] to use my manner
of expression in an attempt to impugn my argument
i'm sure you're familiar with the term 'apologist'
your kind of thinking has led to this present situation
if 'our ally' and even the usa, thinks it can continue
to 'strong-arm' the rest of the world towards it's will,
we have forgotten our recent history circa the 20th century.
when one nation [or an alliance] tries to exceed their reach
the other nation states [and alliances] gather to set them straight
this is where we are now and as the aggressors we will fall [fail]
-
-
no discussion necessary
indiscriminate murder
a war crime and a crime
against humanity
this infernal machine we've
built will surely destroy us
in our lifetimes
and on our watch
-
-
you
did
-
-
well juan
at least we have you
if only there were more
who would listen,
perhaps the new world
would stop ruining the old
we have much more to learn
than we have to teach
-
-
oh, the earth will be here
we're the ones that won't
if we continue
with this nonsense
-
-
wine is the juice
that unties tongues
it let's the mind dance
in worlds far flung
-
along these lines i'll throw this one, out there :
-
the void is not empty
it's filled with light
of this i am sure of
with all of my might
the world is troubled
as i rest tonight
half in darkness
something’s not right
the day will break
the sun will rise
and i'll see things
through different eyes
i hope that my visions
not clouded by doubt
peace among all of us
is the only way out
-
now i write these off the cuff
usually in five minutes or less
but i did notice a symmetry here
sometimes i count the syllables,
for balance
cheers
and thank you juan
for the translations
est
george orwell - meets plato
-
big brother
doesn’t watch you
you watch it
how would you know
if you’ve seen the truth
if you never got dragged up
from that cave
images cast on the far wall
sounds in time with the play
in front of our eyes
didn’t notice being
tied down - fettered
in this state - we stay
-
-
back in the prison
of the pen and page
these thoughts have arisen
i filed relentlessly and
died of old age
-
robert@1:38
could you please define [for me]
what a poet is ?
people keep calling me one
and i don't know how to react
please put it in
eight lines or less
your opinion is yours [but]
that don't make it a fact
-
you could destroy every word
that has ever been written
and still those yet to be born
would surely write many more
what have we really lost ?
nothing - except the future
-
-
yes but
charlie parker
had it going on
i defy any one
to do what he did
maybe we should
have listened harder
when you hear the truth
you can't close your ears
when the universe sings
you know we got to dance
-
-
there are two things going on here
one is insight - the other is vision
really though - they are each - and both -
the same thing - one looks in - the other out
once in awhile a man comes along
that combines these in such a way
that the whole world takes notice
generations heap praise upon him
-
we came from the stars
we're headed to space
here but a moment
this empirical place
our life's but a tangent
that touches this earth
if we play our cards right
this'll be our last birth
-
yes
we have one here in vermont
after forty years
they want to re-license
it for twenty more years
vermont is unique in that
it is the only state that can
nix their plans through
the legislature [and they have]
it is of the same design
and manufacturer as Fukushima
'nuff said
don't ya think ?
and of course
they will skirt
full [and prompt]
de-commissioning
[entergy]
war is always a failure of diplomacy
nothing to be proud of
on the contrary
it only brings shame to the participants
and needless suffering to the aggressed
do we really want force
to be the answer, again ?
-apparently-
'an eye for an eye...'
[makes all of us blind]
so easy to fight the battles
over there
if you don't think there coming here
study a little history
'we are all
Fukushimians
now'
-
this is a bell that can't be unrung
nor can it's sound be tempered
it rings in the heart of every man
tell me you felt nothing when the
oppressor was finally relieved
when the roar went up in the streets
yes juan
here you have spoken many truths
you have the words and perception
of a warrior but you fight with words
and we all know about the pen and sword
-
lot's of things
started in egypt
'bout time something
ended there too
-
-
let me
jump in here
the people
will be replacing him
-
the french have a word -arnaque-
roughly translated it means a trick,
a swindle, a con a trap even
that's what we have here
[prelude to iraqi invasion]
and if you think back
this is when things
took a wrong turn
in so many ways
as such
april glaspie
plays a role
well acted
i might add
tragic
none the less
thank you
for the map[s]
juan
i can recommend the
nat/geo article on iran
and pbs rick steve's
documentary
-
when they have surrounded us
by taking mexico
then canada
i'll start worrying
wait
i see it now
afghanistan
-ok-
pakistan
-iraq-
ok
if a house falls on you
you are obviously a witch
'and the little dog too'
only a witch would
say that
W.B Yeats
Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.
Surely some revelation is at hand;
Surely the Second Coming is at hand.
The Second Coming! Hardly are those words out
When a vast image out of Spritus Mundi
Troubles my sight: somewhere in the sands of the desert.
A shape with lion body and the head of a man,
A gaze blank and pitiless as the sun,
Is moving its slow thighs, while all about it
Reel shadows of the indignant desert birds.
The darkness drops again; but now I know
That twenty centuries of stony sleep
were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle,
And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?
'we all
died a little
in that war'
[outlaw -
josey wales]
---
let's not
die a lot
in this
next one
yes juan
well said
there is something about the truth
it has a certain ring to it
sort of like crystal
it is easily heard
impossible to deny
once it makes that sound
so much better
than speaking a lie
and knowing it
catastrophic
for the teller
devastating
for the recipients
'always tell the truth
it's so much easier
than remembering
a lie"
est
p.s.
never go to war
on a pack of lies
there is a huge difference
my friend
from those that can't choose
to those that can
and don't
willful ignorance
not one of dantes'
lower
bowgies
but hell it is
no less
from the nicholson translation:
"he who
says that he finds no pleasure in sounds and melodies and
music is either a liar and a hypocrite or he is not in his right
senses, and is outside of the category of men and beasts. Those
who prohibit music do so in order that they may keep the
Divine commandment, but theologians are agreed that it is
permissible to hear musical instruments if they are not used for
diversion, and if the mind is not led to wickedness through
hearing them. Many traditions are cited in support of this
view. Thus, it is related that A isha said : " A slave-girl was
singing in my house when Umar asked leave to enter. As
soon as she heard his step she ran away. He came in and the
Apostle smiled. O Apostle of God, cried Umar, what hath
made thee smile ? The Apostle answered, A slave-girl was
singing here, but she ran away as soon as she heard thy step.
I will not depart, said Umar, until I hear what the Apostle
heard. So the Apostle called the girl back and she began to
sing, the Apostle listening to her." Many of the Companions
have related similar traditions, which Abu ( Abd al- Rahman
al-Sulami has collected in his Kitdb al-Samd 2 ; and he has
pronounced such audition to be permissible. In practising
audition, however, the Sufi Shaykhs desire, not permissibility as
the vulgar do, but spiritual advantages. Licence is proper for
beasts, but men who are subject to the obligations of religion
ought to seek spiritual benefit from their actions. Once, when
I was at Merv, one of the leaders of the Ahl-i hadith* and the
most celebrated of them all said to me : "I have composed
a work on the permissibility of audition." I replied : " It is
a great calamity to religion that the Imam should have made
lawful an amusement which is the root of all immorality." " If
you do not hold it to be lawful," said he, " why do you practise
it ? " I answered : " Its lawfulness depends on circumstances
and cannot be asserted absolutely : if audition produces a lawful
effect on the mind, then it is lawful ; it is unlawful if the effect
is unlawful, and permissible if the effect is permissible."
Chapter on the Principles of Audition.
You must know that the principles of audition vary with the
variety of temperaments, just as there are different desires in
various hearts, and it is tyranny to lay down one law for all.
Auditors (mustami anjmay be divided into two classes: (i) those
who hear the spiritual meaning, (2) those who hear the material
sound. There are good and evil results in each case. Listening
to sweet sounds produces an effervescence (jrhalaydri) of the
substance moulded in Man : true (Jwqq) if the substance be
true, false (bdtil) if the substance be false. When the stuff of
a man s temperament is evil, that which he hears will be evil
too. The whole of this topic is illustrated by the story of
David, whom God made His vicegerent and gave him a sweet
voice and caused his throat to be a melodious pipe, so that
wild beasts and birds came from mountain and plain to hear
him, and the water ceased to flow and the birds fell from the
air. It is related that during a month s space the people who
were gathered round him in the desert ate no food, and the
children neither wept nor asked for milk ; and whenever the
folk departed it was found that many had died of the rapture
that seized them as they listened to his voice : one time, it is
said, the tale of the dead amounted to seven hundred maidens
and twelve thousand old men. Then God, wishing to separate
those who listened to the voice and followed their temperament
from the followers of the truth (ahl-i haqq) who listened to the
spiritual reality, permitted Iblis to work his will and display
his wiles. Iblis fashioned a mandoline and a flute and took
up a station opposite to the place where David was singing.
AUDITION. 403
David s audience became divided into two parties : the blest and
the damned. Those who were destined to damnation lent ear
to the music of Iblis, while those who were destined to felicity
remained listening to the voice of David. The spiritualists
(ahl-i mctnf) were conscious of nothing except David s voice,
for they saw God alone ; if they heard the Devil s music, they
regarded it as a temptation proceeding from God, and if they
heard David s voice, they recognized it as being a direction from
God ; wherefore they abandoned all things that are merely
subsidiary and saw both right and wrong as they really are.
When a man has audition of this kind, whatever he hears is
lawful to him. Some impostors, however, say that their audition
is contrary to the reality. This is absurd, for the perfection of
saintship consists in seeing everything as it really is, that the
vision may be right ; if you see otherwise, the vision is wrong.
The Apostle said : " O God, let us see things as they are."
Similarly, right audition consists in hearing everything as it is
in quality and predicament. The reason why men are seduced
and their passions excited by musical instruments is that they
hear unreally : if their audition corresponded with the reality,
they would escape from all evil consequences. The people of
error heard the word of God, and their error waxed greater
than before. Some of them quoted " The eyes attain not unto
Him" (Kor. vi, 103) as a demonstration that there shall be no
vision of God ; some cited " Then He settled Himself on the
throne" (Kor. vii, 52) to prove that position and direction may
be affirmed of Him ; and some argued that God actually
"comes", since He has said, "And thy Lord shall come and
the angels rank by rank" (Kor. Ixxxix, 23). Inasmuch as error
was implanted in their minds, it profited them nothing to hear
the Word of God. The Unitarian, on the other hand, when
he peruses a poem, regards the Creator of the poet s nature
and the Disposer of his thoughts, and drawing an admonition
therefrom, sees in the act an evidence of the Agent. Thus he
finds the right way even in falsehood, while those whom we have
mentioned above lose the way in the midst of truth."
well
the solution
[hesitate to use the word]
seems simple to me
every single last one
should get as far away
as fast as they can
let them have
what they covet most
left to there own devices
they will soon be toast
the whole world
should help them leave
and let's see what happens
when the ones who practice
to deceive finally get their wish
i say let that piece of stone behind
truly inherit the earth
and all mankind
can breathe a sigh of relief
that's how to solve this puzzle
break the siege not for trade
but to help them to leave
let the bastards have their
ill gotten gain and stop hiding
behind the real settlers
that's right the ones
that have been there
the whole time
feel free to substitute
us for them
and they or their
at any time
yes juan
a vast improvement
much easier to read
one request though:
please do not change the format
so that it is so wide that we have
to shuttle back and forth to read it
paul at 'war in context' and phillip
at 'mondoweiss' have done this
and it is very frustrating trying to
read them in said fashion
thank you for your efforts
very much appreciated
est